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Rundown
This episode explores (and critiques) the infiltration of white nationalist, racist rhetoric into the vegan movement, as well as the growing trend for the alt-right to consider veganism as foundational to their ideology. We start by outlining some of the ways in which white nationalism has been seeping into the online vegan community. We follow that with a discussion of how vegetarianism has been intertwined with Nazi ideology historically, which continues to the present day. Next we provide an analysis of how fascism is capitalism in decay, and how it’s a lack of understanding of political economy that allows people to be swayed by racist populist rhetoric. And finally we wrap it up with a condemnation of anti-semitism in leftist spheres as well, explaining why certain anti-capitalist groups are falling prey to the ‘Jew-as-greedy-banker’ conspiracy theory. As vegans and(/or) leftists looking to build allyship and grow our movements, we must wholeheartedly denounce fascism, white nationalism, and racism in all forms.
Sources and Links
- Bite Size Vegan’s video ‘Was Hitler A Vegetarian?’: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhsQuUL2jd4
- VICE’s ‘Why so many white supremacists are into veganism?’: https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/evb4zw/why-so-many-white-supremacists-are-into-veganism
- Marine’s video with Laura Schleifer on Israel and Palestine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAhcgrtlKwQ
- YouTube video by Yaron Brook (a right-wing Jewish man who believes anti-capitalism is inherently anti-semitic): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFXUJHWlo1A&t=2799s
- Anti-semitism in Art: https://www.huffingtonpost.com/bernard-starr/five-stages-of-anti-semit_b_6707728.html
- Further reading (books): Anti-semitism: A Historical Encyclopedia of Prejudice and Persecution, and Saracens, Demons, and Jews: Making Monsters in Medieval Art
- ARZone Total Liberation Interview 8- Svetlana Chibireva and Laura Schlieffer on Holocaust memes: http://www.arzonepodcasts.com/2017/12/arzone-total-liberation-interview-8.html
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14 thoughts on “4. White Nationalism, Anti-Semitism and the Vegan Movement”
Great episode as always and congratulations to both of you on startig this podcast, I’m super-hyped about it! In Germany and Switzerland there is a marxist-animal-liberation alliance. They have a small booklet about why marists should also include the the oppression of non-human animals in the analysis of capital + why people struggeling for animal liberation should adopt marxism and the historical materialism to better understand where this oppression comes from and how to end it. I’d love to share it with you once it is out!
Something specifically about this episode: I searched the Lenin quote and I believe it is actually a misattribution because Lenin did not witness the hights of fascism himself. I think the actual quote is: “imperialism is capitalism in decay”. But your analysis is still spot-on. I think the DDR expert of fascism, Kurt Gossweiler, has written extensively about that connection, but I myself also still need to read up on it.
Something I wanted to comment on your first episode: The definition of veganism you gave, seems more of a definition of anti-specisism. Those it then still make sense to have seperate words, if what we mean is the same thing? For me a better characterisation of how I understand veganism; it’s the practice resulting from anti-speciesism that often manifests itself by what a person consumes or boycotts, because of this being the readiest way of polictical action within capitalism since capitalism adresses people as agents mainly as consumers (which is, as you said, very problematic). I believe this veganism as a form of anti-speciesist activism has it’s warrant, because “the private is political”. I love this feminist slogan because it allows to understand structural problems of something that is seen as “private” or as intimate as housework, sexual relations or what we eat.
Thank you so much. We’re hyped that you’re hyped! The Marxist-Animal-Liberation Alliance sounds incredible, please do share it with us once it’s out. And thank you for the info: re the quote, that does make sense. We’ll check out Kurt Gossweiler’s analysis too.
As for veganism, I think it means different things to different people. I (Mexie) would say that it’s more than anti-speciesism and what you do or do not consume, but a political rejection of the structures at play that produce this exploitation as well. Capitalist plantbased agriculture continues to exploit and harm humans (which are animals) around the world. Some people are also not in a position financially or for whatever reason to consume 100% vegan products in all aspects of life, but can direct their activism in other ways. Freegans for example may at times consume animal products but they’re completely rejecting commodified food access, seeking to not contribute to harm to both humans and animals. The private is certainly political and we shouldn’t contribute money and demand for these terrible products, but I think for us the definition goes a little further than that. But I understand how they appear very similar 🙂
Great talk as always!
Yeah and vegetarianism is not the only thing the Nazis stole from the “India-Asian area”, the Swastika is a famous example, but even the word “Aryan” comes from Indo-Iranians and has been used by some Indic peoples to describe themselves back in history.
Only a while ago I used to be a “question everything person” (meaning that I used that phrase a lot) but when I questioned stuff like “what about the jews/what if the nazis actually where right?” I didn’t stop. I keept on questioning, oppositional questions as well, I mean ‘everything’ includes the questions themselvs and then those qs, etc. So I find it very weird that people has used that trope to become nazis, because it only brought me to the conclusion that anti-semitism and those conspiracies are stupid and that nazism is a horrible ideology.
“We could do a whole episode on that.” Please do! Write down the topic on a list everytime you say that because I’ve heard it on this podcast several times before 🙂
I now realised how wierd it is for these anti-semetic ‘globalist’ conspiracy theorists to on one hand call jews capitalists (I mean ‘globalists’) who control the world, yet on the other hand connect jews to communism by calling communism a jewish ideology. How have I not seen this insane contradiction before!?
Hahaha “Nazis were the real socialists!”, “Antifa are the real fascists!”, “What do you mean that I’m changing the meaning of words to fit my narrative??”
PS: I love Mexie’s spontaneous laughter at ridiculous nazis, it’s great!
Oh and I forgot to mention that I think Israel has the highest percentage of Vegans in the world at like roughly 5%. Yeah, Nazis saying that veganism align with their ideology is weird on so many levels.
Thank you so much! Glad to know that there are some people who *do* indeed “question everything”, which actually leads them to well-researched and coherent conclusions. Very true on pointing out that strange contradiction as well. You’d think they would be questioning it themselves…? And that’s right about Israel, although the morality of veganism certainly conflicts with that of the occupation. Anyway, thanks for the support and engagement! We really appreciate it.
“Who said that?”
“Lenin…”
“Silence…”
Laughed my fucking ass off! 😀
😂😂😂, glad you enjoyed!
Great episode. Reminds me of a paper I read recently on “econationalism” in the post-soviet states. Apparently many (often disillusioned by the stillborn politics of the green mainstream, COPP etc.) are turning to this kind of, ‘hyper rustic’, almost maoist, but strictly right wing, ideology, where, basically its “lets all be pesants again” you know? “Its these damned progressive technocrats who ruined everything! We’ve got to go right back to patriarchy, racism, tribalism etc.” This is really dangerous stuff!…Actually, its just like how the facists hijacked working class disaffection in the 20th century leading to Hitler isn’t it? Got to watch these guys. Anyway, great video. Cheers.
Totally dangerous stuff. We can’t all be peasants again anyway, even if the patriarchy/racism/etc. wasn’t a thing. Gotta watch these guys for sure. Thanks for the comment 🙂
“baklava cooch” is hilarious
Please, please, please post up the thread with you trolling the golden one’s twitter, or give us more information on it – he’s my favourite doofus and I love watching him trying to defend himself because he always fucks it up.
I’ve also just started watching all your videos, Mexie, I love your channel.
Another great podcast. I’d like to add a little to the discussion if I may. I know the video was about antisemitism but there was something that was in the podcast that I found interesting as it relates to my aunt whom I ive with. She is not as far as I know an anti semite but she did vote for trump. what i wanted to mention is how just like you guys mentioned in the podcast there are people who instead of asking why is the world the way it is, why are black people is such shitty communities, why are there immigrants coming by the hundreds to the US, they just assume its because they’re lazy, or whatever other horseshit nonsense they want to pull from their ass. This is literally my aunt at least for immigrants not so sure about other contexts. It’s interesting when she talks about why she voted for trump, her only Argument is that those lazy immigrants are mooching off the system and that my taxes paying for them to live. as a side note we’re a mexican family, so it just makes me more upset hearing her say stupid ass shit. any way as soon we have a talk about this i always say ok tia (spanish for aunt) how about asking the question WHY ARE THEY COMING HERE? WHY ARE THOSE COUNTRIES SO SHITTY? i start telling her about all the coups the US has commited against those countries and she literally said she doesnt want to know about it so i said to her ok so youre being willfully ignorant. I asked her why is trump trying to buy greenland? why is he trying to open up logging industry in alaska in a forest that is literally untouched? she says i dont know and i dont care i just dont want lazy people living off the system while i have to work for my shit. Then i say ok so why are you not concerned with the money your taxes go to funding corporate subsidies? why not care about the money going to fund the manufacturing of weapons? she never answers those two questions. It really hit me when you guys were talking about people who dont ever ask the question WHY???? its always the people never structural policies put in place that benefit those at the top. not theyre just lazy, when talking about why corporations go to third countries she says its because theyre a businesss and are just doing what is best for them economically, theyre just doing whats best for them. so then i say ok if an immigrant comes here and doesnt work and just mooches off the system isnt that them just doing what best for them? now they get to live and they dont have to work? isnt that what we all want? to do the least amount of work or the most amount of pay? so wouldnt you want to not have to work and still live? what the difference? she never answers that one either. its funny to cuz shes mad about her boss sending some of the work she does (medical billing) to india. ok but why? isnt you boss doing whats best for her? what the problem? again never answers the question.
one last thing is this thing about jew being these greedy capitalist who fuck over everyone around them. If you havent read David greabers debt the first 5000 years i highly recommend it. there a part were he talks about jew being thought of as being the parasites of society but he talks about how they got that infamy, in a nut shell the catholic church had a very strong stance on usury they were vehemently against it and they would excommunicate anyone who did it. anyway we know the church hated jews for allegedly having killed the christ. they only allowed jew to do certain things in society, jews were very limited in what they could do in society to gain a living, one of those was usury. so essentially jews in a sense really were people fucking everyone around them (during the middle ages to be clear) but only because it was either that or you died of starvation as you were not able to do anything else to make a living. pretty fucking convenient isnt it?